Jump to content

Recommended Posts

22 hours ago, Limitless said:

That is it and it is issued by the ENP.  The private company that conducts the education course and test is contracted by the ENP to do so.  The requirement will be put in place after a reasonable period of time for boaters to learn about the requirement and get a permit.

☝️This is what I have heard from a number of NPS law enforcement down at Flamingo as well. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 hours ago, Limitless said:

That is it and it is issued by the ENP.  The private company that conducts the education course and test is contracted by the ENP to do so.  The requirement will be put in place after a reasonable period of time for boaters to learn about the requirement and get a permit.

OK, that explains my confusion (that plus a few years of football and getting hit on the head by surfboards from time to time), no requirement right now, but in the near future, when boaters become aware of the requirement, then it will be required.

Thank you for the info, I'll take the test right now...let's see, the pointy end of the boat is the bow???  The boat coming from the starboard side is the privileged vessel, unless you drive in Atlanta where no one else ever has the right of way but you...got it.

See you out there.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, Ron in Atlanta said:

OK, that explains my confusion (that plus a few years of football and getting hit on the head by surfboards from time to time), no requirement right now, but in the near future, when boaters become aware of the requirement, then it will be required.

Thank you for the info, I'll take the test right now...let's see, the pointy end of the boat is the bow???  The boat coming from the starboard side is the privileged vessel, unless you drive in Atlanta where no one else ever has the right of way but you...got it.

See you out there.

Ron:  There's no "right of way" in Sandy Springs either!

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Thanks guys for this information.  I wonder how folks that are not lucky enough to have a Maverick Boat Company built boat (that comes equipped with an online Forum) are getting this info.  Big surprise at the entry gate!

You are right, those of us with experience down there may not need this but it sure will help with the inexperienced folks who show up with a deep Vee center console boat and tear the grass up.

IMG_3527.thumb.jpg.2999555c4021f310c2b15c2904fd0194.jpg

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 7 months later...
3 hours ago, rubble said:

I will be in Choko this winter.  Wondering what I will need to be legal if entering the park from the Choko/EC side?  

  Not to sound like a smart *** rubble, that is not my intent; but if you are in Choko you are already in the park. If you are in E/C you really have no where to go but in the park since it is surrounded by the park boundary. Get the permit to be safe.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was pulled up on for a safety check the week before last near Rock Hole Key. The very young ranger asked for my fishing license, boat registration, ENP park pass & ENP boat pass. He then proceeded to ask if I had any weapons and where my weapon was stored. After giving him the answer he requested that I hand him the bag where it was safely stored. I responded with, "That's a very unusual request and it doesn't make me feel very safe". He said, "I need to do this because I don't know who you are & I want both of us to be safe." I told him, "Well, I don't know you either but I do know that the reason I bring a weapon aboard with me is to be able to protect myself and you're trying to disarm me." He then asked me for the bag again & requested that I comply in order to expedite his safety check as he had his radio in hand & looked like he was about to call back-up. I was fuming pi$$ed at this point but I complied & didn't say a word. He then measured my fish, made sure I had all my safety gear, gave the bag back to me & told me to have a great safe day. This is the 2nd time I've been disarmed by a ranger in the ENP. 🤬 🤐 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Capt Donh was almost shot for not complying with a Ranger down on the South Bank of Lostman's about a year ago.

The Ranger asked me do we have any weapons on board....I responded, "No".  DonH was moving around the back of the skiff to sit down, and the Ranger said, "Don't move around the skiff", As Donh was fiddling with his tackle bag.  DonH's hearing is on the margin, and he continued to move to the other side of the boat.  The Ranger, the proceeded to say, "Don't move around the skiff", and Donh still couldn't hear him as his motor and radio were blarring....at this point, I saw him reach for his firearm on this belt and I yelled, "Don Stop Moving", as loud as I could.....Don stopped on the seat and raise his hands....I was like....REALLY ????? Two old guyz, 6 fishing rods, coolers, and on the beach in Lostman's.....why not focus on people who are really breaking the regulations ???  I don't think we looked like a threat......

dc

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please............

Give these guys a break, They are all alone in the middle of no where with on backup anywhere close and are ALWAYS out numbered. Just do exactly as they ask, always tell them if you have a gun and surrender it upon request. If you do these things most every time you will be on your way shortly. If you do not like the way you were treated, do not let on, take note of their name and the date and time and call their jurisdiction to let their superiors know. The feed back will do them good and maybe some training is in order.

Don"t FORGET........If YOU are in need these are the guys that will come running through storm and fire.     

   Thanks

p.s.   I know there are some butt heads out there, I have had contact with a few, but in the moment is NOT the time to express your discontent.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, conocean said:

I told him, "Well, I don't know you either but I do know that the reason I bring a weapon aboard with me is to be able to protect myself and you're trying to disarm me."

A Law Enforcement Officer has every right to detain and disarm you in his presence even if it's temporary to complete his/her investigation whether you are legally carrying or not. If you are going to take on the responsibility of carrying a firearm then take on the responsibility of knowing the law. Comments like that to an Officer trying to do his/her job actually give them more reasonable suspicion that something may not be right and he could have taken an extra step of handcuffing you and patting you down for his safety until he determined that you were not a threat or did not have any other weapons on or about your person and if you refused, it would only get worse for you from there. Very easy to justify by your comments to him, carrying a firearm and the fact that he's out there by himself and no backup for miles. If you have a concealed weapons permit , this would have been drilled into your head during the course. Common sense. 🧠

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/28/2019 at 10:31 AM, conocean said:

I was pulled up on for a safety check the week before last near Rock Hole Key. The very young ranger asked for my fishing license, boat registration, ENP park pass & ENP boat pass. He then proceeded to ask if I had any weapons and where my weapon was stored. After giving him the answer he requested that I hand him the bag where it was safely stored. I responded with, "That's a very unusual request and it doesn't make me feel very safe". He said, "I need to do this because I don't know who you are & I want both of us to be safe." I told him, "Well, I don't know you either but I do know that the reason I bring a weapon aboard with me is to be able to protect myself and you're trying to disarm me." He then asked me for the bag again & requested that I comply in order to expedite his safety check as he had his radio in hand & looked like he was about to call back-up. I was fuming pi$$ed at this point but I complied & didn't say a word. He then measured my fish, made sure I had all my safety gear, gave the bag back to me & told me to have a great safe day. This is the 2nd time I've been disarmed by a ranger in the ENP. 🤬 🤐 

I'm with you Paul, and Dino and Donh too.  A Ranger on a friendly stop, checking licenses, permits, safety gear and coolers for illegal catches is enough of an encroachment on my freedom, without probable cause.  But, to ask me to surrender my firearm, rendering me defenseless, while he remains armed, is unconstitutional.  It's precisely the reason the Second Amendment became The Law Of The Land.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think we are safe , in the park .

It is why we go there .

To get away from the concrete jungle .

I always bring my weapon , because , my weapon is safer with me , than just sitting in my truck .

There are ramp critters .

That being said , if LEO wants , needs , has to see or inspect anything on my sled , it is yes sir , thank you sir , is there anything else you need sir , and finally , be safe and have a great afternoon sir .

Hats off and full respect from me and all of my team .

🇺🇸🏴‍☠️

 

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 hours ago, SkinnyH2O said:

A Law Enforcement Officer has every right to detain and disarm you in his presence even if it's temporary to complete his/her investigation whether you are legally carrying or not. If you are going to take on the responsibility of carrying a firearm then take on the responsibility of knowing the law. Comments like that to an Officer trying to do his/her job actually give them more reasonable suspicion that something may not be right and he could have taken an extra step of handcuffing you and patting you down for his safety until he determined that you were not a threat or did not have any other weapons on or about your person and if you refused, it would only get worse for you from there. Very easy to justify by your comments to him, carrying a firearm and the fact that he's out there by himself and no backup for miles. If you have a concealed weapons permit , this would have been drilled into your head during the course. Common sense. 🧠

You are correct. I know the laws in the ENP very well and have been pulled up on by rangers at least 40 times in my 25 years of fishing the ENP. I had been asked if I possessed a weapon almost every time but only two rangers (both young) have disarmed me.

My stand point is the same as a ranger....I’m alone out there with no back-up and we don’t know each other. Hence we should both be able to protect ourselves at all times. The concealed weapons permit course I took did not address a LEO’s rights to disarm me but I understand why the rangers disarmed me. I have a great deal of respect for the dangers they face in the ENP but it’s not a good feeling to be disarmed by a ranger I must hope is a good person & does their job with integrity.   

My post was simply to inform & give my story for others that may run into the same situation. 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, THE OUTLAW said:

I think we are safe , in the park .

It is why we go there .

To get away from the concrete jungle .

I always bring my weapon , because , my weapon is safer with me , than just sitting in my truck .

There are ramp critters .

That being said , if LEO wants , needs , has to see or inspect anything on my sled , it is yes sir , thank you sir , is there anything else you need sir , and finally , be safe and have a great afternoon sir .

Hats off and full respect from me and all of my team .

🇺🇸🏴‍☠️

 

We're on the same page Ralph.  You're right.  It's best to be totally accommodating and respectful, like you said.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, THE OUTLAW said:

I think we are safe , in the park .

It is why we go there .

To get away from the concrete jungle .

I always bring my weapon , because , my weapon is safer with me , than just sitting in my truck .

There are ramp critters .

That being said , if LEO wants , needs , has to see or inspect anything on my sled , it is yes sir , thank you sir , is there anything else you need sir , and finally , be safe and have a great afternoon sir .

Hats off and full respect from me and all of my team .

🇺🇸🏴‍☠️

 

👍 Agree!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well said Bubba.  Thank you for sharing some of your wisdom, gained through many years of honorable public service.  It's probably more noticable to us older fellows, than it is to the younger generation, but since 9-11, the bad deeds of a few have forever changed the American way of life for millions of good, law abiding citizens.  A law enforcement officer's job has to be much more stressful and difficult now as well, with all the new security protocol requirements that have been instituted since 9-11.  As everyone should, I have to keep reminding myself that a LEO's job is very hazardous with possible life threatening situations around every corner, and I shouldn't judge another unless I've walked a mile in his shoes.  Still, I can't help longing for the simpler times of my youth, when interaction with law enforcement was more like you'd see on the Andy Griffith Show.
Thanks again for your service Bubba.  We need more good men like you out there, keeping us safe.

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/30/2019 at 10:19 AM, Bubba B said:

I am curious about this statement! My definition of "almost shot" is a weapon pointed in my direction and trigger finger has transitioned from a safe position and actually starting a trigger pull.  Hand resting on firearm in holster and/or gun out of holster in a low ready position, are tactical positions taken as perceived  threats present themseelves. PERCEIVED THREATS  are by definition, the perception of the individual, and therefore could be flawed depending on training and experiance. 

Bubba,

Your experience out in the world you lived and working within, yes, is completely different than mine.  All of what I described,  took place in less than maybe 10-15 seconds.  There was the FWC officer yelling at Don, me yelling at Don, the FWC officer yelling at me to yell at Don - e.g. "Tell your buddy to sit down !!!",, Don moving about not hearing anything due to a roaring FWC radio in a rocking boat, was a bit of confusion as you could imagine.

When I saw the officer reach and unclip and going into as you describe, the low ready position, was quiet un-nerving to me and Don to the point of Don raising his hands.  This is not what I would have expected sitting at the mouth of the Lostman's for simple safety and fishing check....again, I have not experienced your world on a day to day basis, so, as i respect your perspective, I only ask you to understand my frame of reference.  

I have lived and travelled to some of the most dangerous regions of Colombia and Central America when I sourced produce.  I've been stopped by the militia, had "manos arriba"  on  one occasion. As a marine corp vet, those actually bothered me less than what I experienced, in the park (maybe because I was 20 years younger), as I felt something so simple as a fishing stop could have gone sideways.  To me, it was a matter of the environment and what was taking place

Again,  I have been stopped by probably 20 - 30 times in my 40 year fishing career.  Offshore, I've been stopped by the Coast Guard, who were well armed, openly holding automatic weapons as the seaman boarded my Dusky offshore pointed downward, but, in an overwatch of their shipmate.    It never bothered me, because I understood their dangerous conditions, I was courteous, not moving around, and I knew this is part of their routine and the weapons were part  of their gear....been boarded a dozen times by FWC in the park, all a PIA because you loose 1/2  hr of the tide, but all were courteous and uneventful.  Even when I got a ticket for not having my fishing license on me, the stop was all matter of fact.

I only described what took place in those split seconds.  Actually, after things settled down, the FWC officer was very courteous, checked our registration, checked the coolers and left in less than 10 minutes.  It was not a JAB at FWC in general and never occurred to me file a complaint.  I  was just telling my experience of an uncomfortable experience on the water....and thought maybe it was a bit over the top....but, I'll close with....I don't live in his or your world where everyone you meet during work - e.g. a stop, etc., could be a felon or be in a position to inflict bodily harm....what happened to us, was, I thought was maybe not reasonable to two old farts in a 17 foot skiff.

And maybe the word should have been "could have" vs. "almost"....but, to me there was little difference.

 

DC

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Sounds like a bad snapshot in time, Dino.. The terrible shame is the pay scale for the State Law Enforcement agencies and the Park Service... Starting salary is around 18 bucks an hour. With the battery of psychological tests they must pass, incoming kids hired may have never even arm-wrestled anyone yet.  They have to watch all the Officer-Down training films.. and you never know what kind of BOLO's they have heard about recent crimes.. Maybe "two older W/M's reportedly shooting gators & Crocs from a green boat"..

Point is.. young Cops can get scared..  Glad it turned out OK.   Sorry he rattled you.  I get stopped on my boat a lot and I watch how the cops handle it. (and I act like an idiot if they don't throw out bumpers before they tie off on my hull)

There is a significant, vocal eco-faction that wants to blame every problem in the Park on us..  And the Park Bosses demand the Rangers check, inspect, cite and try to catch the greedy fishermen dirty.  They have to stop so many boats a day to show they are working.  Of course the Rangers know better, but they have to meet expectations for their evaluation$.

My advice is.. Act cool, give them what they want, and they will be gone sooner.  They are just doing their jobs..

 

Woodsie

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, MWoods said:

They have to watch all the Officer-Down training films.. and you never know what kind of BOLO's they have heard about recent crimes.. Maybe "two older W/M's reportedly shooting gators & Crocs from a green boat"..

Marc, you are 100% correct....as I said to Bubba, I don't  live in your world or those of your fellow officers, past and present...Donh and I were out for a day of fishing and, when I saw the FWC officer approaching, I went into my yes sir, no sir mode, gathering my documents as he approached.

11 hours ago, MWoods said:

Sounds like a bad snapshot in time, Dino.

That's what I described.....

 

11 hours ago, MWoods said:

My advice is.. Act cool, give them what they want, and they will be gone sooner.  They are just doing their jobs..

 

I agree again 100%, as I mentioned, once things settled down, he was gone in less than 15-20 minutes, most of the time, it was a simple process of lifting hatches as he over saw me moving around the skiff, looking in a cooler, the live well, a simple process - and by the way, I felt in no way threatened at any point during this formal process.....he didn't keep his hand on his side arm....we chatted about where were we from, he called in the numbers and once he realized we were not crock poachers, but, a couple of guys on a day of fishing....it was a normal stop..something I'm glad they are out there performing...

Enough said....let's go fishing.

 

dc

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

FWIW. As of yesterday (11/30/19) The park ranger at the Flamingo gate is still telling folks that "they" will be checking for your permit when you arrive at the launch ramp. I've been told this for 3 months now and have yet to see anyone checking anything at the ramp. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...