Help pricing an 2003 18 (needs work).

[ofdphildo]

Hey guys looking for help with thoughts on a price for a 2003 18 Master Angler with 150 Yamaha HPDI.

So this boat is around the corner from me and I have been watching it sit for years. This morning I finally knocked on the door and asked about it. An older gentleman answered the door.  As mentioned its an 03 18 MA. Here's what I found.

Hull: The hull all in all is solid and doesn't appear to be abused. The bottom has very little sandbar rash and looks great.  The green hull is badly oxidized, as is the deck and console.  Very few spider cracks on deck, checked around transom near motor and didn't find any cracks. The compartments all looked good. Some rubber gasket is old. Hull has not been messed with as far as drilling in accessories and such. The wiring looked pretty good under the console.

Trailer:  Both tires are rotten and flat.  The trailer will need a solid evaluation and will need gone through, if not just replaced.

Motor:  Thinks the motor has around 300 hours, the gauges were replaced so he"s not sure. He said the motor hasn't run in a year, that may be optimistic  This is obviously the Money pit part.  I'm thinking its going to need all the usual stuff. Plugs, water pump, fuel lines, fuels pumps, separator, lower unit oil, trim and tilt cylinders may need done, as well as steering cylinders. Need to ensure heads aren't seized. I would also go through the oil system and replace oil. I would have the tank drained and cleaned.  Would an 03 have a poly tank? Not sure but I thought they went poly at some point.That's  just off the top of my head. I didn't pull the cowling at this point.

I'm sure I'm missing something but that was just a quick 15 minute look over.  So as mentioned this boat has been sitting , but seems very true.  Needs a good bit of work both cosmetically as well as mechanically. It has a TM and Stiffy push pole, and he has tires for trailer (unknown condition) and other stuff that goes with boat. So I offered him 8k as is.  He said if he was going to sell he would take it to a mechanic to have it worked on and would want 13-15K. I think that is a little high. I told him I would want it as is so I could verify the work. I'm not in the market for another boat, but is a MA and I cant bear to watch this thing rot.  What say you guys? Thanks. Attached a couple pictures.

 

[HoneyB]

I have been looking for a 17 MA for a while. In doing so I have seen quite a few 18’s. If he doin it in and spent the coin to get it running and a nice detail job I do not think he is off the mark very far on his price. This is only from seeing asking prices on MA’s for several months. I could be off myself. 

 

[fishmanjj]

Maybe shoot around 10K as is in CASH......come with two trailer tires and wheels to show him your serious. Ready to take her home....

[F1sh0n]

I ended up selling my 18MA in better shape for less than my new engine cost.  It’s been 2 years, but just saying.

[Wanaflatsfish]

$10K is probably a good offer.....

 

I have the same trailer - it will most likely need a new axel and tires = $1200, rewire the lights and new lights ? $200 or so.

I would bring along a new battery and have him put on the muffs and bring a compression gauge - easy to get from Harbor freight, etc about $40.  Have him crank the engine and take a compression test on each cylinder....if you don't see a huge difference, (I can't remember the correct pressure) - so, it's something you can report back....

The engine...yes, figure all you mentioned, as well as changing out all the oil in the 2 stroke tank....you might need a whole new system....so, figure on $500 or so or maybe less if only the pump - $200 - you'll need all new filters, etc. and probably need to drain the fuel tank = $300-400 for this.....impellor, etc. 

total engine work, i'd estimate @ $1500-2K....

Wiring?  Need to figure another $1K or so as you might be finding a rat's nest.

so, I'd on top of your offer - say $10K

 

You have:

Trailer - $1200-1500

Engine - $1.5-2K

wiring, hydraulic system ?  and misc $1.5K

Trolling motor set up - batteries, new TM, wiring, etc. - $2500

So, about $6-8K on top of your offer...

Just my $.02....

 

 

BTW, THERE IS A 17MA FOR $18K THAT IS TURN KEY....I WOULD GO FOR THAT ONE VS. A FIX ME UP PROJECT.....

 

WHILE DIFFERENT, A 17MA WILL CUT DA CHOP LIKE BUD-DA

I OWN ONE

 

DC

 

DC

 

[J.N]

That's a good motor that doesn't like sitting. I'd replace all the fuel filters and get the injectors cleaned and flow tested before thinking about running it.

[Lap it Up]

8K was a good / fair offer based off current condition.  You are taking a gamble on that tank.  He is going to pay some good money to get that boat into the 15k range.  A good marine mechanic is not cheap and cheap mechanics are not good!!!!  If you want to entice him a little more offer him 9k, but that would be my limit. 

[triplec]

Agree with Lap...8K is on point. I would agree with you in that I would want to do the re-work myself or at least use my mechanic. My .02 is if it has sat this long unused he isn't likely to take it to the shop anytime soon either. His comments kind of reminds me of the ads you see where the price is "firm" then couple weeks later they reduce the price. Ummm...probably missed a sale being so "firm." Using the word firm in an ad and saying you are going to fix it then sell it for more...don't promote fast sales usually so it will likely be there at Christmas in the same shape.  Be "firm" lol 🤣!

My Dad always said what you are selling is worth exactly what someone will give you when you need to sell it...you are fair and fall is coming so me thinks patience is the key on picking this one up. 

[ofdphildo]

Thanks for the thoughts so far. I definitely agree with your comments.  There is some risk involved in this motor.  As I mentioned, the hull seems very true just needs TLC so that's whats enticing. 

J. N : I was thinking the same as far as injectors go.

I was thinking the same the 9k was my limit. I may go back over and see If I can poke around some more. Any idea if this fuel tank is poly? "whichwayup" had a poly in his 2000....?

As I said, I'm not in the market for another boat. I just hurts to see this thing rotting away.

Thanks

Phil

 

[whichwaysup]

This is one of those deals that is hard to price because everything is unknown.   

Le'ts just say this boat ends up being one step above 'worst case scenario' - Meaning, the hull is structurally solid, but:

- Motor is toast 

- Wiring is chewed through by rats below decks

- Tank is leaking

- pumps/lights are dead

- Trailer needs fairly sigificant work to be roadworthy

At that point, this is, at best, a 5-7K boat.    But that's worst case scenario.

Best case scenario, you have to re-do some wiring, replace a few pumps, do some engine maintenance, clean her up - 14K in this market would be a steal.

The problem you have is that you have to "price in" the uknown.   As is/unverified, 8K seems like a good bet.  At 8K you can repower and do a fair amount of work without blowing past the resale value, so 8K is a decent, if low, bet.   If that motor runs well and everything is just cosmetic + elbow grease, 8k would be a steal.    On the other hand, you may have to swallow hard and realize that your 8K boat will be a driveway ornament unless you are willing to put another 12K into it.   If for 20K you'd like to have a really nice MA, repowered, re-wired, and shiney and reliable, then go for it.  

You want my advice?  Buy it for whatever you can, but only if you are willing to put a total of 20K into (including the purchase).   IF that doesn't scare you, then this gamble is unlikely to leave you disappointed, and will probably leave you feeling like you scored.   If 20K all-in scares you, there are too many indicators to rule out the possibility that it could require that much investment.   

I guess the ONLY mistake you can make in this is buying a boat you will only be happy with if you don't have to put a lot more money into it.   That is bound to lead to buyers remorse.   If you want an MA and have the scratch to put some money into it, this would be a good bet, and maybe a GREAT one if you discover you have to put in less than 12k to get the boat you wanted.   

[ofdphildo]

***! That was poetic. LOL. Well said.  I think I will go back and check out the boat some more and then go from there.

[HoneyB]

The best money is to let him get it going and buy it on the low end of his numbers. Trouble is once he finds out what the cost of that is he will likely not want to sell it for those numbers. Not unusual really for someone to think because the brand is desirable there sitting on a pot of gold. 

[hurricane]

I think 8k is to low, yes there is risk, I'd offer 10k.  Even at 13k, and the motor is no good, there's motor on here for sale for 4k. That's 17k, another Grand in clean up and parts, you're at 18k. That's still a good deal. 

I'll bet the motor is fine. 

[smilemaker]

If the boat is for a fun project and you don't  need it as your only boat I would go up to 9,000 just to be nice about it.

Let him know that he can drop 3 to 4 grand getting it into shape and still have to wait to get any extra profit. Have easy access to the cash and tell him easy money now or risk any investment on having it brought to excellent condition. Tell him to let you know when he is ready. Any further  interest will cause him to want more.

[whichwaysup]

13 hours ago, hurricane said:

I think 8k is to low, yes there is risk, I'd offer 10k.  Even at 13k, and the motor is no good, there's motor on here for sale for 4k. That's 17k, another Grand in clean up and parts, you're at 18k. That's still a good deal. 

I'll bet the motor is fine. 

Gabe, this was actually my first reaction too.  

[ofdphildo]

This is definitely just going to be a project. I've never owned a MA before though..... So every one things the motor will turn out ok?

[HoneyB]

Everyone is not going to say the motor will be fine. A lot of people think that a motor that has been sitting is a disaster. Personally I think if it was running when he parked it the worst thing will be the fuel system. If it spins over and has good compression fuel systems can be cleaned up. I hung a Ox66 fuel injected motor on a boat last year. The motor had not been run in over 6 years. It tried to run but coughed and sputtered and just wouldn’t level out. Took it to the shop and they replaced the low pressure fuel pumps and cleaned some stuff up and she purred like a kitten. 

[whichwaysup]

The OX66 is a good motor, but a motor that sits that long is a gamble.   The good news is that they are tough, reliable, and relatively simple motors (2S), so it can be fixed and will be cheaper (and better in a lot of ways) than new power.    OR, sell it and get a fuel sipping, quiet, but heavier 4S.    

an 03 MA is a good find.  It's tough to try to stay pessimistic about it.

[hurricane]

As long as the compression is good, the rest can be fixed pretty easy. This is an HPDI motor, so the VST will need a good clean out, along with the fuel. 

ofdphildo, if 10+K is too much of risk for you let me or someone else know, I could have interest.

 

[ofdphildo]

Update:

So I went back and climbed around the boat a little more, found a few new things.

So it turns out the boat has been rewired at some point by Master Repair. I saw their name on the switch panel last time but didn't ask about it.

Apparently the large rear compartment has had the bottom replaced, he said there was a problem with this and it was replaced by MBG.....?

Still didn't get to see the motor, batteries are obviously dead so couldn't trim motor to get cowling off.  Had to fight off the wasp too.

Tried to get eyes on fuel tank, no luck.

The trailer is pretty bad, all the main brackets are pretty much almost rusted through.

He had the boat full of water still from the storm. Not sure I like all that weight sitting in boat. That's just me though.

 

[linesider 159]

9K would be my max, maybe 9500 if I had a battery on it and most things worked/engine fired off. That boat will retail 14-16000 cleaned up. Odds are fuel system needs cleaning ($500), misc wiring and such ($500), detail ($800 ish). Then the steering and trim probably need some attention and those can cost a pretty penny. IMO if you buy for 9k you will probably end up with 12 or so in it, which would put you in the boat right. 

[justfish]

Had that same motor and let it sit too long, water built up in tank etc and was close to $2k having tank pumped and all the filters replaced.  Theres a bunch.  I wouldn't try motor til fuel was changed, thats what lead to me getting into motor work rather than just pumping out tank.  Great motor but likes clean fuel.  

 

Tank is in the belly (why you can't see it) and uncoated aluminum.  If boat is kept as you say (like full of water since storm weeks ago) that tank is capable of giving problem soon.  Search for MA tank replacement threads here and on the FB.  Its a big undertaking.   

[ofdphildo]

20 hours ago, justfish said:

Had that same motor and let it sit too long, water built up in tank etc and was close to $2k having tank pumped and all the filters replaced.  Theres a bunch.  I wouldn't try motor til fuel was changed, thats what lead to me getting into motor work rather than just pumping out tank.  Great motor but likes clean fuel.  

 

Tank is in the belly (why you can't see it) and uncoated aluminum.  If boat is kept as you say (like full of water since storm weeks ago) that tank is capable of giving problem soon.  Search for MA tank replacement threads here and on the FB.  Its a big undertaking.   

Definitely wasn't going to try and start the motor until fuel system was cleaned.  Good point on the water sitting in boat around fuel tank. Didn't think about that.

Don't think its going to happen right now.  He still wants too much money as it sits.

I forgot to mentioned the registration stickers are from 2017 so...

 

[linesider 159]

Probably sentimental value. Forget it and move on. If the guy isn't even close to 10 no sense in continually going back and looking at it 

In addition, the whole idea of snagging a boat that needs TLC is inherently risky. You're going to run into issues. Rather than trying to pick apart the entire thing, make an offer you're comfortable with and just go for it. The fuel tank could last 10 years or fail tomorrow, it's out of your control so unless the bilge has fuel don't worry about it. Worry about the trailer, wiring, and motor. Those are the big 3.

[whichwaysup]

^^^^this^^^^   Simply make him an offer, make it a standing offer, leave him your contact info, and let time do the rest.   Water sitting inside the boat for that long is no bueno.  The stringers are foam filled, so that water has found ways into them and that foam is now soaked and saturated.   it will take a long time, up to a year, to get it dried out, and that water sitting on raw fiberglass is going to make it brittle.    Shame.    show him this thread, it clearly shows the market he is dealing with.    

 

whatever you do, convince him to at least keep the plug out!!!