Hewes 21 Redfisher restoration.

[Josh B]

20 hours ago, whichwaysup said:

Josj, sorry I ddint see this earlier, but there is a product called Sonuus at most auto parts places.  Spray on, wipe off, and it does an amazing job of eliminating oxidation.   I used that and sharkhide on my last two older trailers and it has been great.    I have also been usimg cold galvanized spray paint from lowes on the winch and other areas, seems to hold up well.   

This stuff I used was pretty acidic... it definitely let me know when I had a rip in my gloves. Yew! 

My corrosion was pretty bad, all raised up on the surface... so I'm going to hit it with some light sanding. But I'll check that stuff out next time around. Thanks for the info on the paint as well. 

Josh B.

[RacerxV6]

Question, The video uploaded here showing the vacuum system.  Is that how most of the glass boats are now built.   No one hand lays anymore? or very few do...

[geeviam]

44 minutes ago, RacerxV6 said:

Question, The video uploaded here showing the vacuum system.  Is that how most of the glass boats are now built.   No one hand lays anymore? or very few do...

Most glass boats are not built with vacuum infusion, yet.  But, it's catching on.  Maverick Boat Co. was one of the first, if not THE first boat builder to use the vacuum assisted resin infusion system named VARIS.  Not to say "hand laid" done correctly isn't as good - it's fine.  But, VARIS done right, ensures that all the layers of glass fabric and core are wetted and bonded with resin, and no voids or air pockets exist in the layup.  It's lighter, yet doesn't compromise strength.

Sorry if I derailed this thread.  Just thought I'd share thoughts on voids in the layup.  😊

[RacerxV6]

3 hours ago, geeviam said:

Most glass boats are not built with vacuum infusion, yet.  But, it's catching on.  Maverick Boat Co. was one of the first, if not THE first boat builder to use the vacuum assisted resin infusion system named VARIS.  Not to say "hand laid" done correctly isn't as good - it's fine.  But, VARIS done right, ensures that all the layers of glass fabric and core are wetted and bonded with resin, and no voids or air pockets exist in the layup.  It's lighter, yet doesn't compromise strength.

Sorry if I derailed this thread.  Just thought I'd share thoughts on voids in the layup.  😊

I didn't either.  Thanks Gary for the knowledge...

[Josh B]

Finally got a chance to work on the boat this weekend and made some progress. 

All of the repair areas were previously glassed and sanded down. I went around the entire boat checking for small chips and picking them out to expose any voids. I found a few, most all of them were on the sharp edges where the glass just didn't get rolled tight into the mold. I filled any voids or damaged areas that were more than 1/8" deep with epoxy/camosil blend (peanut butter). 

Then I started on the fairing of the previously repaired areas. It took multiple layers of fairing/sanding to get the high spots knocked down and the low spots built up. While I waited in between fairing I started sanding the remainder of the hull. Using 150 grit I sanded the entire hull front to back. Of course anyone who has ever done a good amount of sanding knows that getting in the tight corners and bends is the most fun... my fingertips are definitely sore. 

After I started sanding the hull I came across several previous repair areas (nothing big, just small keel chips, etc.) that I wanted to make sure I spent some extra attention on. I also found some hairline stress cracks that were not obvious before. I went ahead and used the die grinder to grind out all those cracks and get them filled in. The last thing I want is to have stress cracks appear through my new paint job.

I'm still planning to do a thin skim coat of fairing compound over the entire hull to fill in any slight scratches. I'll sand that down, wipe the whole boat with wax degreaser before spraying the first coat of high build primer. Looking forward to getting to that this week if I can squeeze it in. 

Josh B.

 

 

 

[Wanaflatsfish]

18 hours ago, Josh B said:

I'll sand that down, wipe the whole boat with wax degreaser before spraying the first coat of high build primer. Looking forward to getting to that this week if I can squeeze it in. 

Great rebuild....??? why are you painting vs shooting with gelcoat?

We discussed this with my guy at Fiberglass by Design and he said go gelcoat (on the floor and hatches and console).

He mentioned it would hold better long term and is easier to repair chips....

DC

[whichwaysup]

I was thinking the same thing.  Oysters and paint dont seem to be a good combo.  Gel doesnt like them either, but is thick enough to survive them.   

[Josh B]

8 hours ago, Wanaflatsfish said:

Great rebuild....??? why are you painting vs shooting with gelcoat?

We discussed this with my guy at Fiberglass by Design and he said go gelcoat (on the floor and hatches and console).

He mentioned it would hold better long term and is easier to repair chips....

DC

 

3 hours ago, whichwaysup said:

I was thinking the same thing.  Oysters and paint dont seem to be a good combo.  Gel doesnt like them either, but is thick enough to survive them.   

 

Hey guys, 

Well I did a ton of research and in the end I was still on the fence with which one to go with.  Pros & Cons to both products. One reason I chose paint was because I'm painting black. Dark colors are generally more prone to fading with gelcoat. They can obviously be buffed and polished, but it takes a lot more work to keep black gelcoat looking nice versus black paint. A friend of mine has a black gelcoat boat and it looked amazing new, but looks dull and chalky after a few months of use. The number one advantage to gelcoat is the thickness and durability, however if you do damage it or need repairs it's a more difficult process to match and more effort in sanding. One of the things that made me want to try paint is that gelcoat is a more brittle material, the thicker it is the more brittle it becomes and more prone to cracking as it will not flex with the boat. Over the years just about every boat I have had (including new MBG products) have had stress cracks. I'm hoping that the paint will not be as susceptible to stress cracks. The last reason was because I am using all epoxy based resins and primers. The epoxy based products are supposed to be the best out there for strength and bonding... but they don't play nice with gelcoat. You can apply a special primer over epoxy based products to use gelcoat, so it was still an option but I didn't want to risk it. 

I am using Alex Seal top coat paint and also apply 2-3 coats of clear coat. I'm hoping that the clear coat will help protect the surface with several layers of base/clear versus a standard 1 part paint like Awlgrip. 

From all the videos I watched, forum posts, and FB boat builders pages the consensus I got was that gelcoat is great when spraying in a mold, but a good majority of the people with more experience than me recommended painting. Who knows, it could be a mistake... but had to make a decision and I'll just have to do my best to not ding her up. Of course I'm sure I'll end up buzzing some oysters at some point, but you'll only see it if you're laying on your back under the boat.

For anything on the topside that gets heavy foot traffic I agree that gelcoat is the way to go. Just for the abuse it gets dropping weights, nets, castnet, etc. 

 

Josh B.

[mulligan]

I'm no pro by any stretch but there are some high end builders that use paint, I was just by Gause so they come to mind.  From what little I know, if the right paint is used and applied correctly, it can be just as good as gelcoat. 

[Josh B]

46 minutes ago, mulligan said:

I'm no pro by any stretch but there are some high end builders that use paint, I was just by Gause so they come to mind.  From what little I know, if the right paint is used and applied correctly, it can be just as good as gelcoat. 

Basically all the big time high dollar yachts are painted... Hatteras, etc. but they are also generally well taken care of. My biggest concern is the loading/unloading on the trailer bunks. I'm redoing the bunks and paying a little extra for the thicker/heavier carpet... but it's still a concern. But like you said, Gause and many of the custom shops generally go with paint over gelcoat. I really think either would be fine, but I'm a big fan of Andy @BoatworksToday and he raves about the Alex Seal paints so I'm rolling the dice with it.

Josh B.

[BradM]

On 8/4/2021 at 9:33 AM, Josh B said:

Thank you. I grew up restoring cars with my dad... I was sanding many of late nights when I was a youngster. Now I'm doing these projects myself, but with lots of help from my dad still and he's in his 70's. I'd say at almost 40 I know about half of what he does. 

The boat was never used after the damage. The previous owner was coming in from fishing when he hit a submerged floating piling. He kept driving to the ramp at low speed and put it on the trailer. I honestly think the voids are from the factory and the layers of glass were never properly bonded. Maybe too little resin, maybe they just didn't take the time to make sure they were rolled in good. But once a good bond is made between the layers you shouldn't be able to pull them apart without ripping/shredding the glass. The voids were too clean for that to have happened, the surfaces were very smooth between the layers. 

Now hitting a submerged piling will always cause damage, but I think it was considerably worse in this scenario because of the voids. 

It happens with production boats. You'll see people complaining all the time on the forums/fb, etc. about cracks/chips in fairly new boats. This is almost always because of voids between the gelcoat and top layer of glass or because of voids in the layers of glass which ends up cracking through the top layer because of reduced strength. It's unfortunate, but fairly common. 

Josh B.

Hey Josh, 

Did you buy this boat from the Branford, FL area.....near the Suwannee River? If so, I know this boat and the previous owner, which makes this all the better to follow. Furthermore, if it IS that boat, he and his buddy are lucky to be alive. One thing for sure is that it has had some epic inshore fish on it! 

[Josh B]

21 minutes ago, BradM said:

Hey Josh, 

Did you buy this boat from the Branford, FL area.....near the Suwannee River? If so, I know this boat and the previous owner, which makes this all the better to follow. Furthermore, if it IS that boat, he and his buddy are lucky to be alive. One thing for sure is that it has had some epic inshore fish on it! 

Yes sir, that's where she came from. I've talked with him on FB, but wasn't sure if he was a member on here or not.

Josh B.

[RacerxV6]

19 hours ago, Josh B said:

Basically all the big time high dollar yachts are painted... Hatteras, etc. but they are also generally well taken care of. My biggest concern is the loading/unloading on the trailer bunks. I'm redoing the bunks and paying a little extra for the thicker/heavier carpet... but it's still a concern. But like you said, Gause and many of the custom shops generally go with paint over gelcoat. I really think either would be fine, but I'm a big fan of Andy @BoatworksToday and he raves about the Alex Seal paints so I'm rolling the dice with it.

Josh B.

Josh,  one thing you can do to the bunks is after you carpet there are lots of products out there that you can place on top of it that will allow the boat to slide more effortlessly.  Also, Gatorback is another product that replaces carpet.  I have something very similar to gatorback on my trailer, however my hull is aluminum not glass and it is painted rather than gelcoated.  It has held up really well loading and unloading.  When I get home today I'll take some pics....

[jh141]

I second GatorBak.  It is expensive but is excellent with Gelcoat and Paint. Has a low durometer number but does not wear,

DO NOT USE Caliper Wrap with anything but Aluminum. It is very hard and will wear Gelcoat. Been there done that.

All my bunks are done in GatorBak.  Makes on and off the trailer "very" easy. 

 

 

 

[Josh B]

So my father called me yesterday and asked if I minded if he worked on the boat... I guess he can't stand seeing it sitting there all day without doing something. He said "I know this is your project, so I'll leave it alone if you want... but I figured I could do some stuff while you're at work". 

I do wish I could work on it more, but 8-5 job & the family are a bit of a time constraint. So I told him to go for it, do whatever you want. Well he got the whole boat skim coated with fairing compound yesterday before lunch, setup for 3 hours and then sanded the entire thing. This morning he calls me and says he's getting ready to spray the high build primer. 5 hours later and he's got 3 coats of high build primer sprayed. He said it laid down really nice and there's only a few slight imperfections that he can see might need some attention. 

One issue is that the repaired side of the hull is now completely flat and straight... where as the original side of the hull does have some slight waves in the surface. You can really only see it when you get down and look at it with the reflection of the light. But right were each wave indentation happens is exactly where the bulkheads are at throughout the boat. 

But overall, for the first coat of primer it looks great. Going to wait over night (12 hours recommended) before starting to block sand the whole thing. That will be a labor intensive process, but it's really the only way to do it so you make sure you get it straight. The high build primer only came in white, but the next 3 layers of primer will be the finishing primer that is dark gray. 

Josh B.

[Josh B]

Thanks @RacerxV6 @jh141, I have heard of Gatorbak... I'll look into it more! Might be a good candidate for it. 

Josh B.

[RacerxV6]

Josh,

 

Is that a second boat project i see at the entrance of the garage?

[Josh B]

5 hours ago, RacerxV6 said:

Josh,

 

Is that a second boat project i see at the entrance of the garage?

Funny story about that one... so as I mentioned my dad restores old cars/trucks. He has since before I was born. He was down the road helping a friend with a tractor and the neighbor had two old boats in the yard. He started talking to him and the guys dad had just passed away and left these two complete boats/trailers to his son. The son was cleaning the place up. He told my dad to take them both if he wanted them that he was just going to take them to the dump. They were both 50-60's model boats. My dad kept the nicer of the two and gave the other one away. It actually had a early 90's Yamaha 40hp on it. His plan is to restore a similar year truck, paint the truck & boat to match and tow the boat with the truck to the car shows. If it's like most of his other projects he'll finish it, take it to a handful of shows and then sell it so he can finance the next project. He normally has 2 or 3 or 4 projects waiting on him. Not sure what the details are on the boat... he told me I'm sure, but I can't recall at the moment.

Josh B.

[whichwaysup]

Josh, is your father interested in adopting some additional sons?   There are a few projects on my boat I'd like to get done, but I work long hours too.   If I just had a dad like yours, I could get SO much more done! 

Great work, great thread, and even better to see a father and son involved in the project.   

[fishmanjj]

On 8/18/2021 at 3:07 PM, Josh B said:

So my father called me yesterday and asked if I minded if he worked on the boat... I guess he can't stand seeing it sitting there all day without doing something. He said "I know this is your project, so I'll leave it alone if you want... but I figured I could do some stuff while you're at work". 

I do wish I could work on it more, but 8-5 job & the family are a bit of a time constraint. So I told him to go for it, do whatever you want. Well he got the whole boat skim coated with fairing compound yesterday before lunch, setup for 3 hours and then sanded the entire thing. This morning he calls me and says he's getting ready to spray the high build primer. 5 hours later and he's got 3 coats of high build primer sprayed. He said it laid down really nice and there's only a few slight imperfections that he can see might need some attention. 

One issue is that the repaired side of the hull is now completely flat and straight... where as the original side of the hull does have some slight waves in the surface. You can really only see it when you get down and look at it with the reflection of the light. But right were each wave indentation happens is exactly where the bulkheads are at throughout the boat. 

But overall, for the first coat of primer it looks great. Going to wait over night (12 hours recommended) before starting to block sand the whole thing. That will be a labor intensive process, but it's really the only way to do it so you make sure you get it straight. The high build primer only came in white, but the next 3 layers of primer will be the finishing primer that is dark gray. 

Josh B.

Looks like your Dad is doing a great job and I’m sure he enjoys helping and wants to get it finished so he can fish in it later this year. 👍🎣❤️⚓️

[fishmanjj]

5 hours ago, whichwaysup said:

Josh, is your father interested in adopting some additional sons?   There are a few projects on my boat I'd like to get done, but I work long hours too.   If I just had a dad like yours, I could get SO much more done! 

Great work, great thread, and even better to see a father and son involved in the project.   

I am also interested in being adopted by Josh’s Dad to help me with some of my projects. JJ

[RacerxV6]

On 8/18/2021 at 9:45 PM, Josh B said:

Funny story about that one... so as I mentioned my dad restores old cars/trucks. He has since before I was born. He was down the road helping a friend with a tractor and the neighbor had two old boats in the yard. He started talking to him and the guys dad had just passed away and left these two complete boats/trailers to his son. The son was cleaning the place up. He told my dad to take them both if he wanted them that he was just going to take them to the dump. They were both 50-60's model boats. My dad kept the nicer of the two and gave the other one away. It actually had a early 90's Yamaha 40hp on it. His plan is to restore a similar year truck, paint the truck & boat to match and tow the boat with the truck to the car shows. If it's like most of his other projects he'll finish it, take it to a handful of shows and then sell it so he can finance the next project. He normally has 2 or 3 or 4 projects waiting on him. Not sure what the details are on the boat... he told me I'm sure, but I can't recall at the moment.

Josh B.

Funny you mentioned that.  This is from a boatworkstoday Glass Magic Final Episode that I watched almost a year ago.  Super nice....and very cool.

[Josh B]

I'm beyond blessed to have a father that loves to work and loves to help. He's a do-it-all kind of guy and one of the greatest gifts he gave to me was the attitude that you can do anything if you put in the time and effort. Growing up he would never do things for us, but always make us do it and help along the way, teaching us how to figure things out. Everything he knows is self taught, mostly by trial and error. At 70 years old I just taught him how to use YouTube on his TV. Now he's addicted to watching all these "How to" videos, he loves it. 

Unfortunately his schedule stays pretty busy between myself and my brother and his never ending list of projects. I think he has 3 or 4 projects of his own lined up whenever he can get my boat out of his way. I think that's the real motivation here. ha ha

Josh B.

[Josh B]

On 8/18/2021 at 1:02 PM, jh141 said:

I second GatorBak.  It is expensive but is excellent with Gelcoat and Paint. Has a low durometer number but does not wear,

I just ordered the GatorBak for my trailer... man it's not cheap, but hoping it's a worthwhile investment to protect the paintjob. 

Josh B.

[fin-addict]

I’m a big fan of painted boats. Less maint than gel. Have painted a few in my day. Last was 37’ SF. Roller and tip with badger brush and a little thinner. Looked like a spray job and held up great for the five years f owning it. Pettit paint, not two part.

30’ Chris, the deck house and FB was an add on. Had twin 350hp blueprinted Vette engines & 37’ Egg Harbor